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Tim Callahan
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Nineveh: Even when they get it right, they get it wrong.
The Book of Zephaniah and the Book of Nahum both predict the fall of Nineveh, capitol of the Assyrian Empire, to the Medes and Chaldeans; and indeed it did fall to them. The predictions were correct, but were they divinely inspired? Hardly. Both Zephaniah and Nahum lived and wrote at the time that the Assyrian Empire was crumbling. The Medes had already taekn Asshur, the original capitol of Assyria, and they and the Chaldeans were closing in on Nineveh itself. It was logical to assme that it would fall to them.
Not content to let it rest at that, a number of evangelical apologists, Josh MacDowell among them, have concocted a fable based loosely on the prophecy of the fall of Nineveh in Nahum, aided and abetted by a fair amount of folklore, aimed at making Nahum predict the specifics of the fall of Nineveh.
Nahum 1:8 says of God, "But with an overflowing flood he will make a full end of his adveesaries." Nahum 2:6 says, "the river gates are opened" Nahum 3:11 says of Nineveh, "You also will be drunken . . . ."
From this MacDowell and others assert that Nahum accurately predicted their lurid picture of the fall of Nineveh. The fundamentalist scenario goes like this:
Sardanapalus, the last king of Assyria, believing himself safe behind his massive walls, with enough food stored to withstand a seige of three years, proceeded to feast and get drunk. Unbeknownst to him, heavy rains had swollen the river Tgris, upon whose banks Nineveh lay. The rising waters washed away a section of the wall, and the Medes and Chaldeans swarmed in. The last act of Sardanapalus was to climb upon his funeral pyre while having his wives, concubines and horses slaughtered, lest the fall into the hands of his enemies.
This, indeed, was the popular history, celebrated in plays and art. In fact, I used Eugene Delecroix's painting "The Death of Sardanapalus" as my cover art for "Bible Prophecy: Failure or Fulfillment?" for this reason. The sources of this popular history are the works of two ancient Greek historians, Ctesias of Cnidus, who wrote histories between 404 and 398 BCE, while at the court of the Persian king, Artaxerxes II; and Diodorus Siculus who wrote histories in the first century BCE. Ctesias, writing two centuries after the fact, said that the last king of the Assyrian Empire was Sardanapalus. Diodorus Siculus said that Nineveh fell because rising waters of the Tigris River in flood swept away part of the walls of Nineveh. So, given the testimony of these ancient historians, what's wrong with this picture?
The answer is:everything. Ancient histories, such as those of Herodotus, while being valuable sources of information, also often dealt in story-telling when they lacked adequite detail. Fortunately, we have far more ancient documents in the form of precserved records from Assyria and from the Chaldeans.
In fact, there was no Sardanapalus: He is a creature of legend. According to the Assyrian king lists and other ancient preserved Mesopotamian documents, the last kings of the Assyrians, after Ashurbanipal, were his two sons, Ashur-etil-ilani, 631 - 627, followed by his younger brother, Sin-shar-ishkun, 627 - 612 BCE. Sin-shar-ishkun deid in the fall of Nineveh in 612. He MAY hve thrown himself on a funeral pyre as Ninweveh was falling, or he may have fallen in battle. His uncle, Ashur-Uballit II left NIneveh with some die-hard followers and was crowned king in Harran, the last surviving Assyrian stronghold.
The Medes destroyed Harran, and Nebuchadrezzar, crown prince of Chladea, defated the combined Assyrian forces uner Ashur-uballit and Egyptian forces under Pharaoh Necho at Carchemish in 609.
As to a flood and rising river waters causing the fall of Nineveh, the fact is that the assault that breached the city's walls, took place at the Hatamti Gate, one of the few gates into Nineveh that was NOT on a river.
Thus, the grand edifice thrown up by Mac Dowell and others is nothing more than a house of cards. As such, they cannot claim the fall of Nineveh as a miraculous fulfillment of divinely inspired prophecy.
Tim
Last edited by Stormdog, 2/3/2009, 11:01 pm
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2/3/2009, 9:31 pm
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Pastor Rick
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Re: Nineveh: Even when they get it right, they get it wrong.
You do yourself a disservice here Tim. Sardanapalus was also known as Ashurbanipal, As(e)nappar or Osnapper from Marcus Junianus Justinus. "Epitome of the Philippic History of Pompeius Trogus" and the book of Ezra 4:10 (the last depends on which English translation you use). He was the last to reign over the Assyrian Empire and after his reign the empire was a sham, ignored as a source for the redress of grievances even if it existed in a shadow form for 10-20 years after his death.
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2/4/2009, 12:57 pm
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Tim Callahan
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Re: Nineveh: Even when they get it right, they get it wrong.
Thank you for the clarification. I will take note of it, though I wonder if identification of Sardanapalus with Asshurbanipul by later writers might have been as a way of correcting the work of Ctesias. I'll look into this further.
Be that as it may, however, when Asshurbanipul died in 625 the Assyrian Empire was still intact, though shaken. Egypt under the Saite princes, originally tributary clients of the Assyrians, had slipped out of the Assyrian orbit, while remaining an ally.
The empire was also somewhat ravaged by invading Scythian raiders 631 - 624. The Scythians, erstwhile auxilliary mercenaries in service to the empire, apparently decided the Assyrians wouldn't have hired them if they could do their own fighting and proceded to raid the empire west of the Euphrates. They did return to Assyrian service briefly, relieving the initial siege of Nineveh in 615. However, they switched sides at the 612 siege, and their cavalry acted to block escape and sorties from the city.
My main objection to the stretching of poetic metaphors in Nahum to be specific prophecies of the fall of Nineveh still stands. Even if Sardanapalus was Asshurbanipul, that king died in 625, not 13 years later in 612 when Nineveh fell. The Assyrians certainly were not getting drunk behind walls they considered impregnable. They were desperately fighting for their lives. The breach through which the Medes and Chaldeans forced entry into the city was at the Hatamti Gate, one of the few NOT on a a rivier. Nineveh had 12 gates, 8 of which were on either the Tigris or tributaries running through the city.
The picture of the Assyrians as drunk, indolent and corrupt may make a nice story and can certainly be used as a homily; but it probably isn't in any way historical. Consider that as Nineveh was falling, Asshur-uballit, younger brother of Asshubanipul and uncle to that last two Assyrian kings, Asshur-itel-ilani and Sin-shar-ishkun, led an army of Assyrians out of Nineveh as it fell. He was crowned king in Harran, the last surviving Assyrian stronghold. He held on to that city until 609, when the Medes sacked Harran.
With the last Assyrian city taken, the Assyrians under Asshur-uballit II, had they been indolent drunkards, would certainly have given up the fight. However, Asshur-uballit again led an Assyrian force out of a city as it fell. He crossed the Euphrates, joined forces with Pharaoh Necho II at Carchemish and held out there until 605, when Chaldean crown prince Nebuchadrezzar forced a crossing ofthe Euphrates and heavily defeated the combined Assyrian - Egyptian force.
Nebuchadrezzar pursued his beaten foes to the Egyptian border and probably would have invaded Egypt had he not gotten word that his father, Nabopolasser, had died. He hastened back to Babylon to secure his accession.
The Chaldeans made an attempt to invade Egypt in 601, but were defeated by Necho II. Later in his reign, Nebuchadrezzar undertook some military operations against Pharaoh Amasis, but they seem to have amounted to little more than a series of skirmishes.
Asshur-uballit disappears from history following the battle of Carchemish in 605. Either he fell in battle or ended up as a permenant guest of the Egyptians.
Nahum should be taken as a poem celebrating the collapse of Assyrian power and looking forward to the coming fall of Nineveh, nothing more. Tryig to stretch its poetic metaphors to be specific, divinely inspired prophecies of the fall of Nineveh does violence both to history and the Book of Nahum itself.
Tim
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2/4/2009, 2:35 pm
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Tim Callahan
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Re: Nineveh: Even when they get it right, they get it wrong.
Rick:
This is a second reply to your post on equating Sardanapalus with Ashurbanipul.
I'll have to wait until I can get out to the Fuller theological Seminary's McAlister Library to check out the work of Marcus Junianus Justinus. Looking on line, I did see that Marcus Junianus Justinus was writing in the third century. The work you referred to seems to be about Alexander the Great. Can you give me chapter and verse for the reference to Sardanapalus = Osnappar / Ashurbanipul?
What I find in Ezra 4;10 refers to "the rest of the nations the great and noble Osnappar deported and settled in the cities of Samaria and the rest of the proince Beyond the River." Osnappar does seem to mean Ashurbanipul, but I don't see how this connects with Sardanapalus.
I suppose Ashurbanipul could have settled peoples in Samaria (i.e. Israel). However Samaria fell to Sargon II in 722, nearly a century before Ashurbanipul's time. Sargon reports that he deported 27,290 people, rebuilt the city of Samaria and brought people in to populate it from other provinces (ANET 284 - 287).
Tim
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2/4/2009, 6:58 pm
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Tim Callahan
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Re: Nineveh: Even when they get it right, they get it wrong.
Rick:
I found the reference in the work by Marcus Junianus Justinus etc. you referred to. Book 1 has this passage:
The last king that reigned over them was Sardanapalus, a man more effeminate than a woman. One of his satraps, named Arbaces, governor of the Medes, having, with great difficulty and after much solicitation, obtained admission to visit him, found him, among crowds of concubines, and in the dress of a woman, spinning purple wool with a distaff, and distributing tasks to girls, but surpassing all the women in the effeminacy of his person and the wantonness of his looks. At that sight, feeling indignant that so many men should be subject to one so much of a woman, and that those who bore swords and arms should obey one that handled wool, he proceeded to his companions, and told them what he had seen, protesting that he could not submit to a prince who had rather be a woman than a man. A conspiracy was consequently formed, and war raised against Sardanapalus; who, hearing of what had occurred, and acting, not like a man that would defend his kingdom, but as women are wont to do under fear of death, first looked about for a hiding-place, but afterwards marched into the field with a few ill-disciplined troops. Being conquered in battle, he withdrew into his palace, and, having raised and set fire to a pile of combustibles, threw himself and his riches into the flames, in this respect only acting like a man. After him Arbaces, who was the occasion of his death, and who had been governor of the Medes, was made king, and transferred the empire from the Assyrians to the Medes.
I don't see that this author actually identified Sardanapalus with Ashurbanipul. Perhaps you can find a reference. Until then, all I see is more bad history that is at variance with preserved Assyrian and Chladean documents. Certainly, the character of Ashurbanipul was in no way effeminate. He was a strong, able general and a vigorous ruler.
Tim
Last edited by Tim Callahan, 2/4/2009, 7:41 pm
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2/4/2009, 7:33 pm
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Stormdog
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wow.
You went out to a library to do some research in order to address Rick's question?
This chair in my office has wheels so I can roll over to the bar fridge and mix an appletini without getting up.
--- There' s probably no God.
Now stop worrying and enjoy your life.
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2/4/2009, 7:48 pm
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Tim Callahan
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Re: Nineveh: Even when they get it right, they get it wrong.
No. Originally I was going to go to the library, since I didn't think I'd find the particualr part of the text I was looking for on the net. I thought it would be a bit too obscure. However, I gave it another shot and did indeed find the passage on the net by googling both the Roman author's name and Sardanapalus.
Tim
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2/4/2009, 9:42 pm
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Pastor Rick
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Re: Nineveh: Even when they get it right, they get it wrong.
Hey Stormdog... why not? I have the degrees and a fairly good office library but I don't mind doing research when a question is raised that I do not have the answer to. I commend Tim for even considering that idea as it shows me he is being honest in his approach
There is a fascinating History of Assurbanipal written by George Smith in 1871 (I linked to page 353 which discusses both the identity of Sardanapalus and Assurbanipal. G.S. comes to the conclusion that there were actually two men with the identity/title/name of Sardanapalus so far from being mere legend we have to at least give credit to the concept/idea that such a man did indeed live in the time frame being discussed.
I believe the main reason Assurbanipal is identified with Sardanapalus is found by cross referencing his name with the governor/general Abaces named by Marcus Junianus Justinus where the two appear to be tied together.
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2/5/2009, 1:28 am
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Stormdog
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Re: Nineveh: Even when they get it right, they get it wrong.
quote: Pastor Rick wrote:
Hey Stormdog... why not? I have the degrees and a fairly good office library but I don't mind doing research when a question is raised that I do not have the answer to. I commend Tim for even considering that idea as it shows me he is being honest in his approach
Nah. Research is great, but leave my office to do it? Hey, that's why I spent the money on filling my office with books, a wet bar, chairs with wheels, and a fast computer.
I actually can't remember the last time I wrote a letter for snail mail. No idea what a stamp costs nowadays.
I obviously have internet access, so I'm not officially a "hermit".
Yes, Tim's a straight-shooter. I feel comfortable occasionally disagreeing with him (though he's likely right and I'm wrong). At any rate, that's how we learn, right? I'm not going to believe everything he says just 'cause he's the one saying it, and I don't think he'd have it any other way.
--- There' s probably no God.
Now stop worrying and enjoy your life.
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2/5/2009, 2:41 am
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Tim Callahan
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Re: Nineveh: Even when they get it right, they get it wrong.
Rick:
In your last post you said, "There is a fascinating History of Assurbanipal written by George Smith in 1871 (I linked to page 353 which discusses both the identity of Sardanapalus and Assurbanipal."
When I went to the site to check out Smith's History and went to page 353, what I found was that Smith believed that the two men called "Sardanapalus" were none other than Nabopolassar and his son Nebuchadrezzar! These aren't even Assyrians. They're Chaldeans. They weren't thones who lost Nineveh. They're the ones who took it. This isn't helping your case any.
I also pointed out in my last posting that Marcus Junianus Justinus doesn't really equate Sardanapalus with Ashurbanipul. He doesn't even mention Ashurbanipul as far as I can tell. If I have missed something here, tell me where Marcus mentions the last great king of Assyria by his true name.
So we still have the Assyrian and Chaldean preserved texts that mention Ashurbanipul, his sons Ashur-etil-ilani and Sin-shar-ishkun, and his brother Ashur-uballit. None of these texts mention Sardanapalus. Then we have the Greek and Roman texts mentioning Sardanapalus and concocting this fable about the Medes revolting against Assyria because of the effeminacy of this mythical king. All this is compounded by Smith' speculations, which are unsupported by the Assyrian and Chldean texts he himself translates.
So far, you've shown me nothing of any substance to support the idea that Sardanapalus = Ashurbanipul. I notice also that you have not responded to my points that the last Assyrian kings went down fighting and that Nineveh was breached at the Hatamti gate, on dry land.
Tim
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2/5/2009, 4:09 am
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